Essential Depravity

a pk update on original sin and its variants: Total depravity, for example. And I’ve discovered a forebear I’d never heard of: Matthias Flacius

Original Sin, the two words joined, inseparable, OriginalSin, one unified concept, was fed to me as a child in church.
Freedom, democracy, the UnitedStates, the two words joined, inseparable, was fed to me in the secular branch of education: the schools: also from an early age: an age before a mind can see what’s being done to it.

Original Sin
thanx hubpages

There’s a strong streak of conformity in any group. There’s simultaneously a claim to rebellion, to independence: a mistrust of authority goes hand in hand with the idea of freedom: all the cut cookies claim that they’re original, unique, created themselves … are responsible, are virtuous …

Matthias Flacius
thanx phil-fak

My “anarchism” comes both from my church and my school: so how come my other church members, my other school mates, aren’t anarchists?

I know, more or less, what I think, I got there myself, I’m not duplicating exactly any teacher, though there are dozens and dozens of teachers I’m influenced by: Bucky Fuller, Ivan Illich, Ilya Prigogine … Jesus.

A couple of decades ago my son delighted me when, trying to figure me out, he researched anarchism and came up with forebears I love and adore now that I’ve heard of them, though I’d never heard of any of them before: Benjamin Tucker, Lysander Spooner, Moses Harmon … bk mounted this learning to a site, The fed destroyed all my sites, bk didn’t revive them though he had the power, the data, the means; now bk’s sites have all eroded away, gone the route of entropy: treason is easy, all you have to do is nothing.

jump ahead, to conclusion:
I don’t believe any common thing literally: not God, not the US, not science, not any church, absolutely not any school or university, not any Sanhedrin: I see them all as enemies of truth, torturers of Christ. I accept these symbols as rough ideas, not as smooth, perfect ideas.
But, roughly, I embrace OriginalSin. Man is incapable of reason, of truth, of accuracy, of honesty. Oh, not all men. But when Newton dies, “Newton” is taken over by a committee: and that committee did Not invent gravity. That committee isn’t likely to understand what Newton said no matter what’s said to it or no matter what it says.

And a reminder about “God”: when God speaks, how is the Church going to stop him? How is the US going to stop him? How is the judge going to silence the god and commandeer interpretation?
Will God get a word in edgewise about who he loves, who he forgives?
No, no: not with humans assaulting the gates, screaming down the facts.
and not with humans polluting the universe with prayers, pleas, wheedlings. Why don’t we trust god to know what to judge how and with what consequence?

But I don’t want an expert monkeying with the cosmos even if that expert is god. Leave the cosmos alone, stupid species will die soon enough without any miraculous help.

So: I don’t believe in a smooth Christian cosmology, I believe in a rough Christian cosmology: where basic creeds like Original Sin are way-understated.
Original Sin. Total depravity.
The depravity essential, our nature to the marrow, total. Irremediable.

a mess, but as so often before, I mount the scribble, you can watch me work

The church was “Protestant”: the sect Presbyterian, but that hardly mattered: the concept was Christian, orthodox, prescribed, from way back. It means that Adam is the father of all mankind, Adam sinned, Adam disobeyed God, a betrayal, and all of Adam’s descendants, you and me, me and you, are guilty of that crime.

Of course there are overtones of sexual experience in the phrase: conception takes place through intercourse, sex is bad; therefore, there’s no pregnancy, no issue, no generation except through Sin!

Buy a Christian a drink, try to discuss this, you won’t get very far. Christians, like other circles of belief, bounce orthodoxies, creeds, certainties, back and forth at each other; discussion, understanding, penetration is impossible. IQ points on important issues, essential considerations, zero. Satan 1, Man 0.

2013 07 10

I’ve been understood by individuals; never by groups.

Gotta add: It’s not up to the Lilliputians whether or not they understand Gulliver. It’s up to God, not St. Augustine, whether St Augustine understands God, or Moses, or Jesus … or Einstein.
I, pk, recognize that what I say has been understood by this and that individual; But: I’m not aware of any group that’s ever understood any part of the essence of the lifetime of messages!

PS I chose the Fall image above as an alternate to the so well known Michelangelo, but my source page, hubimg, doesn’t ID the painting! Help!

Society Social Epistemology Cosmology Etc.

About pk

Seems to me that some modicum of honesty is requisite to intelligence. If we look in the mirror and see not kleptocrats but Christians, we’re still in the same old trouble.
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